Exclusive Interview with ai16z Founder Shaw: Eliza Framework, DAO Innovation, and How AI is Reshaping the Future of Web3

Author: Asher, Odaily Planet Daily

Yesterday (December 23), Shaw, the creator of the Eliza framework and founder of ai16z DAO, accepted an interview with Odaily Planet Daily during a fan meet-up event in Shanghai, sharing updates on ai16z, degenai, and the deep collaboration project ELIZA, as well as the impact of the AI sector on Web3 in 2025.

Here is the interview transcript

Odaily Planet Daily: You have been quite popular in the Web3 space recently, which must have brought a lot of pressure. Could you share your personal experience and why you chose to step into the spotlight as an anonymous developer in the second half of this year?

Shaw:

I didn't intentionally seek to step into the spotlight, nor did I expect this to happen. It feels very strange because I was just a programmer before, and no one knew who I was. At that time, I was even anonymous, but I gradually felt a disconnect from the crowd, so I wanted to try to be myself and authentically present myself online. Then, I released the Eliza framework, which unexpectedly became very popular and completely changed my life. I never anticipated these events. In fact, I hadn't even realized that the developer field could have a so-called "spotlight."

There is indeed pressure from the outside. I used to enjoy promoting other projects simply because I personally thought they were great, and I wanted to share what I believed in. However, as the DAO started to grow significantly, everyone became particularly focused on token-related matters, which made me feel a lot of internal pressure, and I could no longer casually discuss the projects I liked.

Odaily Planet Daily: The Eliza framework is now one of the most watched projects on GitHub. What makes it special?

Shaw:

I think there are three main reasons. First, it's ready to use out of the box. There are many AI agents and large language model (LLM) related tools available, and while they are all great toolkits, you still need to build the entire agent yourself. Our Eliza framework can be run directly as soon as you start it; it includes everything you might need. Additionally, it offers many plugins, such as Solana plugins and EVM plugins, which are already integrated.

Second, the core of AI agents is centered around the web. I've noticed that many people limit AI to Python research and model development, but I believe the more important aspect of agents is connecting all these models to people through the internet. Therefore, we built it using TypeScript, and Web3 is particularly suited for the JavaScript and TypeScript ecosystem, allowing many developers to get started easily.

Third, we focus on social loops. We have built connectors for social platforms like X, Discord, and Telegram, so developers can immediately run our tools and get their bots online on X without coding. They can then add their own features on top of that, such as integrating EVM chains, allowing them to add a wallet to their agents with minimal code changes. Or, if they have their own software and APIs, they can call them through the agent. Starting with social media is key, and agents on social media can self-promote, making more people aware of their existence and spreading rapidly. I believe this is the reason for its success: agents can easily go live on X, and then everyone who sees it will want one, and they can quickly acquire and use it.

Odaily Planet Daily: Last week, ai16z launched the Binance alpha section and also launched OKX contract trading. Are there plans for further deep collaboration with mainstream exchanges?

Shaw:

Absolutely, we have other team members specifically responsible for these matters. I think we might see more tokens listed and related progress after the New Year holiday, but I can't promise a specific timeline. I believe that the listing on Binance and Coinbase is an inevitable trend, but I am more focused on AI agent-related content, so I can't make any guarantees or provide investment advice.

Odaily Planet Daily: How does ai16z differ from previous DAO organizations in the Web3 space?

Shaw:

I believe the core issue with previous DAO organizations is that while the decentralization aspect of DAO has been achieved, the autonomy part has not been well executed. It is not truly "autonomous" and still requires a lot of manpower for communication and coordination. This has led to many problems, such as a small group of people holding all the power. Typically, some "whales" control all the voting rights; it is difficult for newcomers to enter and contribute to the DAO.

This shortsighted behavior clearly exposes many coordination issues within DAOs. We believe this is where our technology can make a difference, allowing more people to genuinely participate and contribute, and providing rewards for their contributions. We are researching a mechanism for "continuous retrospective funding allocation." The idea is that if you contribute code to the codebase, assist in Discord working groups, or help in any meaningful way, these contributors will receive rewards. This is different from traditional airdrops; it is more like a way to continuously reward contributors. We plan to implement this reward mechanism every month. Currently, we are working hard to develop the relevant features for this.

Odaily Planet Daily: So, do you think ai16z DAO will have its own business model in the future? What will it be?

Shaw:

Yes, our business model is based on the accumulation of token value. At the same time, we are also making some investments, mainly in projects that we believe are very valuable, such as token launch platforms, DeFi platforms, and projects within the ecosystem using AI agents.

We are not like a traditional startup without VC support, but we do have a relatively large treasury, which was donated by a whale. We are using this fund to invest in projects that we think are important and to gain returns from them. We are also developing our own token launch platform and are currently collaborating with the teams we have invested in. This is somewhat similar to the concept of Baidu Fund, and we are also engaging in deeper collaborations with Baidu Fund and some other projects.

Odaily Planet Daily: Last weekend, ai16z's official Twitter mentioned integrating its ecological token economic model. Is it through staking, burning, and other methods to increase token value?

Shaw:

I think burning tokens is not an effective strategy to some extent. At least based on my experience, burning tokens sometimes gives a sense of "dumping," and this approach does not seem to genuinely help the long-term value of the tokens. In fact, if I were to burn tokens myself, it might upset some people because they would feel it undermines their incentives. However, I believe staking is very important. I think any mechanism that can lock up tokens will be very popular. What we are really focused on right now is that our tokens face significant liquidity issues after listing. For example, we have a token with a market cap of $1 billion but only $4 million in liquidity, which is clearly insufficient.

Odaily Planet Daily: Regarding degenai, you mentioned on the X platform that its AI agent will be launched soon. Can you reveal what kind of AI agent it will be and what its core competitiveness is?

Shaw:

Yes, degenai is about to debut; it is the first character we are launching, and it will come with a built-in wallet. Degenai can obtain trading signals through social media, and we will track certain KOLs to see if they are genuinely sharing quality recommendations. If we follow these KOLs' advice, can we make a profit? Or are they actually "dumping" on us? The core of degenai is to establish a trust scoring system that makes trading decisions based on this data. The ultimate goal of developing degenai is to make these tools not only serve us but also be replicable by users to bring into their own communities. For example, users can trade through this agent without having to manually perform complex trading operations on Phantom or DEX Screener.

At the same time, we are currently developing another character that uses the same technology but has slightly different functions. Although some information has already been disclosed, we are in the testing phase and have only opened a very small Alpha chat group by invitation, where users can share trading information.

Odaily Planet Daily: Regarding the ELIZA project, which is deeply collaborating with ai16z, you could have issued it yourself but handed it over to the AVA team. Do you think they are more professional and will do a better job with ELIZA? In what ways will you support the project in the future?

Shaw:

The AVA team showed me an early version of the project. I thought it was cool at the time, and I was willing to work together to ensure the project truly reflects high-quality standards. Additionally, they have some excellent developers on their team. Their vision is to build a platform that not only provides decentralized functionality but also far exceeds the existing Eliza project in terms of user experience and features. They hope to redefine the positioning and application scenarios of the Eliza token, not just as a token or AI project, but as a comprehensive platform encompassing various tools, services, and ecosystems. Support for ELIZA includes:

• Technical support: We will continue to provide support at the technical level, such as code reviews, optimizations, and assisting the project in implementing core functionalities;

• Resource integration: We will leverage our ecosystem and resources to collaborate with them more deeply, including sharing market channels and industry networks;

• Community promotion: We plan to utilize our community resources to help them expand their user base and ensure that existing Eliza token users can smoothly transition to the new platform or accept new features;

• Financial support: If needed, we will assess whether to support the project's long-term development through direct investment or participation in the token economy.

We are very optimistic about their potential and believe this project meets market demand and user expectations. They have the ability to drive the development of Eliza in a more free and creative way, and our support is to ensure the project starts off strong, aligns with our overall mission, and respects its independence.

Odaily Planet Daily: Whether in the Web2 or Web3 space, everyone is optimistic about the AI sector in 2025. Do you think the AI sector will outperform the GameFi Summer and DeFi Summer in Web3 in 2025?

Shaw:

I think it's possible. Ultimately, it still depends on the performance of the global economy. If mainstream assets like Bitcoin continue to perform well, the market may continue to rise. Moreover, I firmly believe that AI will fundamentally change the way the internet operates, and AI agents are just getting started. For example, on the X platform, most of the information I see now seems to be AI-related content, and this change really feels crazy.

Odaily Planet Daily: Finally, do you have any advice for users who are just getting into the Web3 AI space?

Shaw:

Do your own research. I see many people losing money simply because they haven't done any reading or understanding. They just blindly follow trends and start complaining when they lose money. In behaviors like PVP, trends change very quickly, and a few minutes can determine whether you make 1x, 10x, or lose all your money. This rapidly changing environment leads to a phenomenon of blind following. However, those who truly do extensive research will understand all the projects and clarify the differences between this project and that project. If you can spend a lot of time asking these questions and finding answers, your chances of making the right investment will be much greater.

Additionally, I believe that making money is not just about buying a project; you can also engage in liquidity mining. Buy top-performing tokens and put them into liquidity pools. While you may not get 10x returns due to missing early opportunities, you will achieve long-term stable returns, which is what matters.